Prom1
Mar 24, 09:42 PM
I was there at the beginning - in & out 3 times.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ko4V3G4NqII
OS X you've been the Apple of my eye since the beginning!
:apple:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ko4V3G4NqII
OS X you've been the Apple of my eye since the beginning!
:apple:
Ugg
Apr 16, 08:33 PM
Why does it matter that he was gay? I thought that gay people where supposed to be the same as everyone else. Did his being gay give him some sort of super powers to break codes?
George Washington was a very tall man. From all accounts, most people had to literally look up to him. Not telling students that he was a very, very tall man, would seem to be sort of silly. Physical presence has a huge impact on how people are perceived.
Turing was gay during a time when gay acts were illegal. He would be chemically castrated, have his security clearance revoked and for years his accomplishments were tarnished by his "criminal behaviour". It wasn't until 2009 that the British Government apologized for its demonization of Turing.
So on behalf of the British government, and all those who live freely thanks to Alan's work I am very proud to say: we're sorry, you deserved so much better.
So, Mr Kramer, can you honestly tell me that Turing's homosexuality and the way he was treated is historically irrelevant?
George Washington was a very tall man. From all accounts, most people had to literally look up to him. Not telling students that he was a very, very tall man, would seem to be sort of silly. Physical presence has a huge impact on how people are perceived.
Turing was gay during a time when gay acts were illegal. He would be chemically castrated, have his security clearance revoked and for years his accomplishments were tarnished by his "criminal behaviour". It wasn't until 2009 that the British Government apologized for its demonization of Turing.
So on behalf of the British government, and all those who live freely thanks to Alan's work I am very proud to say: we're sorry, you deserved so much better.
So, Mr Kramer, can you honestly tell me that Turing's homosexuality and the way he was treated is historically irrelevant?
jephrey
Oct 12, 09:32 AM
iBeard, you're assuming that the only thing a larger screen is good for is movies/tv. With a 4" screen on the pod, you have a larger viewing area for more than movies/tv. You have it for games, pictures, chat(when available), text, better view of album artwork, and so on. It may not be for you because you may only use your pod for music, but you gotta admit there's a huge market for it.
J
J
firestarter
Apr 22, 12:24 PM
That's an awful idea. Posts will get downrated because someone disagrees with a perfectly valid opinion? I've already seen posts downrated because someone said they prefer Android over Apple or had a good thing to say about Microsoft. Hell, I'd probably get downrated just for my avatar.
As long as people are going to act like little children, using these ratings to hide posts is a horrible idea.
That's why you need meta-moderation. Weighs the balance of votes in favour of those who rate sensibly, stops people from just burying personalities they dislike.
As long as people are going to act like little children, using these ratings to hide posts is a horrible idea.
That's why you need meta-moderation. Weighs the balance of votes in favour of those who rate sensibly, stops people from just burying personalities they dislike.
rtdgoldfish
Mar 23, 04:56 AM
So last night I was checking my email after work and my computer makes a weird beep. I realized that the sound is made by Connect360 when a connection is made to an Xbox. I opened the program and it says my 360 is connected and media is being shared with it. This means that whoever stole my 360 is still in range of my wireless network.
Got in my car with my laptop and found the range on my network is a bit larger than I had expected. About 8-10 houses on my block get at least some signal from my network
This morning at 5am, my 360 connected to the network again and I decided to take a walk around the neighboorhood to see who was awake. I found two houses within range of my network that had a blue glow in the window from a TV. When the 360 was disconnected from the network about 30 mins later, I walked back around and there was one house that no longer had the TV on.
I'm going to call the police department and talk to the officer that has been handling my case. I'm pretty sure I don't have enough information for them to get a search warrant but I'm getting more confident about actually getting my 360 back than I was three days ago.
Got in my car with my laptop and found the range on my network is a bit larger than I had expected. About 8-10 houses on my block get at least some signal from my network
This morning at 5am, my 360 connected to the network again and I decided to take a walk around the neighboorhood to see who was awake. I found two houses within range of my network that had a blue glow in the window from a TV. When the 360 was disconnected from the network about 30 mins later, I walked back around and there was one house that no longer had the TV on.
I'm going to call the police department and talk to the officer that has been handling my case. I'm pretty sure I don't have enough information for them to get a search warrant but I'm getting more confident about actually getting my 360 back than I was three days ago.
milo
Oct 2, 05:07 PM
DVD Jon had previously circumvented Fairplay's DRM in 2003 (http://www.macrumors.com/pages/2003/11/20031122001549.shtml), and since then multiple other tools have appeared to provide similar functionality for updated versions of Quicktime/iTunes. Jon is also credited for developing an algorithm named deCSS to strip a DVD of its encryption (called Content Scrambling System, or CSS), hence his nickname.
Similar for updated iTunes? Is there something that hacks the DCC in recent/current versions of iTunes? I thought they broke a few versions back and recent DRM hasn't been hacked.
They sued over the asteroid thing, and that wasn't even a new idea. Tons of devices do what the asteroid was going to do.
They sued over the release of specific inside information. It doesn't have to be a "new idea" for product info to have value.
Apple is still committed to DRM. When they offer Apple Lossless files for download with CD-writing still enabled then I'll accept that Apple is DRM-ambivalent. Right now they aren't. And with $2 TV shows the bandwidth argument no longer holds water.
Of course they're committed. The issue isn't bandwidth, it's that it's a condition the content owners insist on in exchange for apple being able to sell their product.
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Similar for updated iTunes? Is there something that hacks the DCC in recent/current versions of iTunes? I thought they broke a few versions back and recent DRM hasn't been hacked.
They sued over the asteroid thing, and that wasn't even a new idea. Tons of devices do what the asteroid was going to do.
They sued over the release of specific inside information. It doesn't have to be a "new idea" for product info to have value.
Apple is still committed to DRM. When they offer Apple Lossless files for download with CD-writing still enabled then I'll accept that Apple is DRM-ambivalent. Right now they aren't. And with $2 TV shows the bandwidth argument no longer holds water.
Of course they're committed. The issue isn't bandwidth, it's that it's a condition the content owners insist on in exchange for apple being able to sell their product.
tny
Oct 29, 11:14 AM
Thats wrong, its not free as is freedom. If that was the case I should be able to do as I please with the code and that is not the case. If I use the free(GPL) software as a baseline for a project I then have to turn around and release all the changes I made for free as well. This may be hundreds of hours of work and I don't know anyone that works for free.
So then you only consider the BSD license to be free?
So then you only consider the BSD license to be free?
true777
Oct 4, 04:22 AM
This is the Mac mini of houses at best.
Russell L
Aug 15, 01:21 AM
This is getting very messy.
Another purchaser of the 23" contacted AppleCare and reported this in Apple's Monitor Forum:
"I just talked to an AppleCare specialist and he said that this is still the old model based on my serial number. 2A6241XXXXX and manufactured June 2006"
"I called the apple store online on the phone and asked them how I would get the new one that is as the one they sell now. They said, it is guaranteed 100% that I would get the new one online, but through their retail stores, it is very likely to get the previous model, because they still have the old ones."
So both of us (mine made in May ( 2A6211XXXXX) and yours in June 2006 (2A6241XXXXX) have the old model with the following specs according to his report:
Brightness 270cd/m2
contrast ratio 400:1
So I guess no one can be sure of what they are getting, no matter how or where they buy it.
Well, I sprung for a new 23" at the Apple Store in SF last Friday (along with a new Mac Pro!). I asked the salesman to find me one with the highest serial number, which was 2A6251xxxxx (also June 2006). FWIW, the display was set at its highest brightness setting and was just too bright--I've now got it set at about 25% and it looks terrific. No obvious dead pixels, no pink cast. I also purchased the AppleCare warranty, so I should be covered over the next 3 years.
Russell
Another purchaser of the 23" contacted AppleCare and reported this in Apple's Monitor Forum:
"I just talked to an AppleCare specialist and he said that this is still the old model based on my serial number. 2A6241XXXXX and manufactured June 2006"
"I called the apple store online on the phone and asked them how I would get the new one that is as the one they sell now. They said, it is guaranteed 100% that I would get the new one online, but through their retail stores, it is very likely to get the previous model, because they still have the old ones."
So both of us (mine made in May ( 2A6211XXXXX) and yours in June 2006 (2A6241XXXXX) have the old model with the following specs according to his report:
Brightness 270cd/m2
contrast ratio 400:1
So I guess no one can be sure of what they are getting, no matter how or where they buy it.
Well, I sprung for a new 23" at the Apple Store in SF last Friday (along with a new Mac Pro!). I asked the salesman to find me one with the highest serial number, which was 2A6251xxxxx (also June 2006). FWIW, the display was set at its highest brightness setting and was just too bright--I've now got it set at about 25% and it looks terrific. No obvious dead pixels, no pink cast. I also purchased the AppleCare warranty, so I should be covered over the next 3 years.
Russell
GoKyu
Mar 24, 05:08 PM
As a switcher in I feel I have to give a big thanks to Microsoft and Windows Vista - after all, if Vista hadn't been so terrible, I might not have switched ;)
Happy birthday OS X - here's to another 10 years!!
Happy birthday OS X - here's to another 10 years!!
rroach3753
Sep 28, 12:00 PM
If I touch it on the southwest corner will it not work? ;)
twoodcc
Apr 21, 05:58 AM
Ouch, I know how that is, I've had to replace things that I've broken trying to fix them; not that I would actually admit to breaking anything of course :p
It would drive me nuts being away from my computers knowing they need worked on. I guess I'm addicted - maybe... oh, I put -advmethods in the linux machines and they took off with new wu's so all is well for now. I did lose a bigadv unit on the 17th, or 14th I can't remember, when they had a glitch in one of the servers :(
oh yeah, it's driving me nuts being away. but at least i can go on the weekends.
yeah i lost a bigadv unit also. but hopefully things are good for now. this weekend i know i'll be working on this
It would drive me nuts being away from my computers knowing they need worked on. I guess I'm addicted - maybe... oh, I put -advmethods in the linux machines and they took off with new wu's so all is well for now. I did lose a bigadv unit on the 17th, or 14th I can't remember, when they had a glitch in one of the servers :(
oh yeah, it's driving me nuts being away. but at least i can go on the weekends.
yeah i lost a bigadv unit also. but hopefully things are good for now. this weekend i know i'll be working on this
Appstur
Apr 15, 07:33 PM
The design is nice and I honestly wouldn't doubt that Apple might make the new iphone similar to this since the macs and the ipad are taking that turn, however like others have said, this is a fake because the aluminum would block the 3G receiver. Unless Apple magically found a way to get around that issue! which would be AMAZING!
Here is an idea, because the apple logo is black plastic, why not put the 3G receiver behind the Apple logo? ;)
Here is an idea, because the apple logo is black plastic, why not put the 3G receiver behind the Apple logo? ;)
PygmySurfer
Oct 29, 01:13 PM
There big time investors also won't take 'just because' as an answer to why Apple won't license there OS, if the growth stops than there is no alternative.
They will take "because it'll kill Apple's hardware business, which is where Apple makes most of their money" as an answer, however.
Apple's interests lie in selling high-margin solutions, not bottom-of-the-market extremely low margin PCs.
Think of Dell as Ford, and Apple as BMW.
They will take "because it'll kill Apple's hardware business, which is where Apple makes most of their money" as an answer, however.
Apple's interests lie in selling high-margin solutions, not bottom-of-the-market extremely low margin PCs.
Think of Dell as Ford, and Apple as BMW.
klaus
Aug 12, 04:03 PM
Okay,
The left display in the pic below is one I bought 2 years ago, it was replaced 2 times (this is the 3rd display). The display on the right is brandnew, I bought it on wednesday from the online apple store.
The colors in the picture are exagerated because of the photo itself. The background of the screens is black and the backlight leakage is white irl.
The effect is also not as obvious as in the picture but however, it is there, very visible.
If you look at the highres - http://users.skynet.be/bk318948/macosx.nl/schermen.jpg - then you can clearly see there is ghosting on the right screen.
I've requested for a replacement for the new one. The old one (left) was bought at a dealer. It's still in warranty (applecare) but i'm in some kind of dispute with that dealer, so i'm hoping to take care of it directly through Apple.
On a sidenote, I payed almost 2400 euro (vat incl.) for the left one 2 years agon, the right one, which I bought this week, cost me 1150 euro. Should be enough to be eligible for 2 perfect displays no?
The left display in the pic below is one I bought 2 years ago, it was replaced 2 times (this is the 3rd display). The display on the right is brandnew, I bought it on wednesday from the online apple store.
The colors in the picture are exagerated because of the photo itself. The background of the screens is black and the backlight leakage is white irl.
The effect is also not as obvious as in the picture but however, it is there, very visible.
If you look at the highres - http://users.skynet.be/bk318948/macosx.nl/schermen.jpg - then you can clearly see there is ghosting on the right screen.
I've requested for a replacement for the new one. The old one (left) was bought at a dealer. It's still in warranty (applecare) but i'm in some kind of dispute with that dealer, so i'm hoping to take care of it directly through Apple.
On a sidenote, I payed almost 2400 euro (vat incl.) for the left one 2 years agon, the right one, which I bought this week, cost me 1150 euro. Should be enough to be eligible for 2 perfect displays no?
twoodcc
May 12, 06:40 PM
your very dedicated ;)
have you set up any sort of remote capabilities? so you can remote into each system etc just incase there is something wrong - or to check up on heat?
what are you guy's rigs!?
haha thanks. i try to be.
i thought about doing this, and it wouldn't be very hard to do, but if something goes wrong, there's really nothing i can do remotely. the only things that seem to go wrong is the computer crashing, or restarting. either way, i don't have auto login, so i wouldn't be able to get to it remotely. heat isn't the problem right now (it was when i was trying 4.0 ghz - or 4 x gpu).
my main 3 rigs (i need names!)
1. Asus - running 3.5 ghz i7 920. 2 x GTX 260
2. Alienware - 3.6 ghz i7 920 now. 2 x GTX 260
3. home built (need name) - 3.6 ghz i7 930 now. 1 x GTX 260, 1 x GTS 250.
and i've got my ps3 folding and my macbook pro gpu folding right now, but not all the time
have you set up any sort of remote capabilities? so you can remote into each system etc just incase there is something wrong - or to check up on heat?
what are you guy's rigs!?
haha thanks. i try to be.
i thought about doing this, and it wouldn't be very hard to do, but if something goes wrong, there's really nothing i can do remotely. the only things that seem to go wrong is the computer crashing, or restarting. either way, i don't have auto login, so i wouldn't be able to get to it remotely. heat isn't the problem right now (it was when i was trying 4.0 ghz - or 4 x gpu).
my main 3 rigs (i need names!)
1. Asus - running 3.5 ghz i7 920. 2 x GTX 260
2. Alienware - 3.6 ghz i7 920 now. 2 x GTX 260
3. home built (need name) - 3.6 ghz i7 930 now. 1 x GTX 260, 1 x GTS 250.
and i've got my ps3 folding and my macbook pro gpu folding right now, but not all the time
BRLawyer
Sep 12, 04:41 AM
So, let me see...for those of us NOT living in the US, what do we have?
Movie Store - NOT available (downloading movies is not my cup of tea anyway);
Streaming device for movies bought in the iTMS - NOT available as well
New Nanos with SAME capacity?? - No, thanks...
I was going to receive a (female) friend tonight, but she postponed for tomorrow...so this means I will have instead a big "yawning" session tonight at Apple news/rumor sites, with few things applicable to people outside of the US...move along, citizens... :(
Movie Store - NOT available (downloading movies is not my cup of tea anyway);
Streaming device for movies bought in the iTMS - NOT available as well
New Nanos with SAME capacity?? - No, thanks...
I was going to receive a (female) friend tonight, but she postponed for tomorrow...so this means I will have instead a big "yawning" session tonight at Apple news/rumor sites, with few things applicable to people outside of the US...move along, citizens... :(
KeriJane
Apr 9, 12:50 PM
Let's see....
They're FINALLY going to some sort of UNIX thing.... Like Apple did.
Theyre FINALLY getting some sort of responsible backup system.... Like Apple did...
They're FINALLY going to self-contained applications, like Apple...
They're FINALLY building in PDF support like Apple
Etc, etc....
Why not just skip 8 and 9 and call it Windows 10? Or WINDOWS X.... Just like SURPRISE! Apple did! :p
All of which are necessary and seriously overdue. But how can anyone say it's not just another cheap ripoff of Apple yet again?
My big question is... How is MS going to maintain strict control and ownership of a UNIX core?
Isn't that why they've been sticking with their inferior, outdated and disasterously defective proprietary MS technology up until now?
Have Fun,
Keri
They're FINALLY going to some sort of UNIX thing.... Like Apple did.
Theyre FINALLY getting some sort of responsible backup system.... Like Apple did...
They're FINALLY going to self-contained applications, like Apple...
They're FINALLY building in PDF support like Apple
Etc, etc....
Why not just skip 8 and 9 and call it Windows 10? Or WINDOWS X.... Just like SURPRISE! Apple did! :p
All of which are necessary and seriously overdue. But how can anyone say it's not just another cheap ripoff of Apple yet again?
My big question is... How is MS going to maintain strict control and ownership of a UNIX core?
Isn't that why they've been sticking with their inferior, outdated and disasterously defective proprietary MS technology up until now?
Have Fun,
Keri
Anuba
Jan 12, 03:59 PM
Wow, I just watched the keynote and my god this guy is hard to stand. I've watched previous keynotes and he never seemed this bad. The charisma he's displayed in the past has been replaced with smugness. He acted like the iPhone was the second coming of christ and we were so lucky that he existed to bring it upon us.
Yeah. I love the products but I loathe the man. Then again I'm just a regular user and not one of those scary MacDroids. You know, the ones with the blank stare, the ones that repeat mantras about Windows viruses and the dreaded blue screen of death... some even believe Windows gives you AIDS. They're kind of like scientologists or Jehova's Witnesses. But you gotta keep in mind those were the ones he was addressing, as always. Hence the smugness. The Keynote is his church and he is their god. Notice the constant applause and cheering over stuff like, oh, some new button or menu item. Mac will always be my second platform because these people just scare the poop out of me.
Yeah. I love the products but I loathe the man. Then again I'm just a regular user and not one of those scary MacDroids. You know, the ones with the blank stare, the ones that repeat mantras about Windows viruses and the dreaded blue screen of death... some even believe Windows gives you AIDS. They're kind of like scientologists or Jehova's Witnesses. But you gotta keep in mind those were the ones he was addressing, as always. Hence the smugness. The Keynote is his church and he is their god. Notice the constant applause and cheering over stuff like, oh, some new button or menu item. Mac will always be my second platform because these people just scare the poop out of me.
sethypoo
Jan 12, 12:02 AM
On one hand, I see what you're saying, and I agree that Steve might have been a little smug. But in a sense I think he earned that smugness. He and all the Apple employees who finally finished the iPhone project.
This was a great keynote, and really shows that Apple is branching out, trying to reach users in new ways. It is obvious to me that both the iPhone and the Apple TV are both geared to lure people from the Windows camp over to Mac OS X. Sure, both work with a PC, but only to a point. The iPhone and the Apple TV will work more seamlessly and smoothly with a Mac in the mix. It is for these reasons that I think this keynote was one of the most important in the last five years.
Also, realize that Apple can always very easily announce iLife or iWork 07 anytime they want, as well as hold a special event for a new widescreen iPod or whatever. I think it is very likely that we will see a iLife and iWork update very soon, before January is up. Apple doesn't want to keep a year old product on their store's front page for too long after the new year begins.
This was a great keynote, and really shows that Apple is branching out, trying to reach users in new ways. It is obvious to me that both the iPhone and the Apple TV are both geared to lure people from the Windows camp over to Mac OS X. Sure, both work with a PC, but only to a point. The iPhone and the Apple TV will work more seamlessly and smoothly with a Mac in the mix. It is for these reasons that I think this keynote was one of the most important in the last five years.
Also, realize that Apple can always very easily announce iLife or iWork 07 anytime they want, as well as hold a special event for a new widescreen iPod or whatever. I think it is very likely that we will see a iLife and iWork update very soon, before January is up. Apple doesn't want to keep a year old product on their store's front page for too long after the new year begins.
twoodcc
May 16, 12:26 PM
haha yay! lucky :D let me know how it goes!
yeah finally. but then 3 weeks later and i move. so i'll have a big outage then.
Thought I would post here instead of starting a new thread. How do I get bonus points, all I am reading is -advmethods and setting up a passkey. Would it be worth it on a i7 720qm at 1.66ghz? Would it complete a wu in 4 days?
This passkey sounds like a big deal should I be using it on all me machines?
With the console client for windows, is there a way I can close the window with out it stopping folding, kind of pointless having the window constantly open. Surely it can fold in the background?
Thanks guys :)
hey starting a new thread is a good thing for this forum. we need more activity!
but anyways, to get a bonus you need a passkey. so yes, get a passkey. once you complete 10 units with the passkey, you'll then start to get a bonus if you complete the units in time.
as far as hiding the console client window, i'm not sure. i personally would rather have it open, so i know what it's doing. why not just minimize it?
yeah finally. but then 3 weeks later and i move. so i'll have a big outage then.
Thought I would post here instead of starting a new thread. How do I get bonus points, all I am reading is -advmethods and setting up a passkey. Would it be worth it on a i7 720qm at 1.66ghz? Would it complete a wu in 4 days?
This passkey sounds like a big deal should I be using it on all me machines?
With the console client for windows, is there a way I can close the window with out it stopping folding, kind of pointless having the window constantly open. Surely it can fold in the background?
Thanks guys :)
hey starting a new thread is a good thing for this forum. we need more activity!
but anyways, to get a bonus you need a passkey. so yes, get a passkey. once you complete 10 units with the passkey, you'll then start to get a bonus if you complete the units in time.
as far as hiding the console client window, i'm not sure. i personally would rather have it open, so i know what it's doing. why not just minimize it?
vincenz
Apr 25, 12:25 PM
The only thing that would convince me to upgrade would be a bigger screen. If not then... fuggedit.
Ensoniq
Sep 12, 08:41 AM
I am not sure if the pricing reported earlier for the videos is correct, but I did want to comment on one thing...
If the pricing IS correct ($9.99 for iPod version, $14.99 for TV version, $19.99 for both) then the movie studios who didn't sign on because they didn't feel those prices were fair can go and "F" themselves. :)
Essentially $20 bucks for 2 electronic versions with no DVD packaging, manufacturing and shipping to deal with could make a lot of money for the studios. To say that price is "not good enough" on their behalf just smacks of greed.
Whether $20 a pop is a good price for the consumer is debatable...it depends on their tech level. Those of us reading these forums mostly would rather go buy a new DVD in the store for $20 and then rip it ourselves for our own use. But many others don't want to be bothered, and would be happy to have pre-ripped versions for download and avoid ammassing an even larger collection of DVD boxes taking up space in their bookshelves.
Just like with new Mac computer releases...Apple comes up with options designed for the entire base they plan to sell to, not solely based on "power-user" needs/desires. $20 a pop is NOT "too expensive" for pricing for many...it's not a DISCOUNTED price, but it's a fair price and if the movies need to sell for $20 to get all the studios on board (in the future, if not now), that is more important than trying to be an uber-discount movie sales site.
Those who've mentioned Netflix are missing the point...doesn't matter what Netflix costs vs. iTunes movies because Netflix is a rental-based system and iTunes is purchases you own. If you don't WANT/NEED to own the movies, Netflix is awesome. You can't compare iTunes movies to that market though.
If the pricing IS correct ($9.99 for iPod version, $14.99 for TV version, $19.99 for both) then the movie studios who didn't sign on because they didn't feel those prices were fair can go and "F" themselves. :)
Essentially $20 bucks for 2 electronic versions with no DVD packaging, manufacturing and shipping to deal with could make a lot of money for the studios. To say that price is "not good enough" on their behalf just smacks of greed.
Whether $20 a pop is a good price for the consumer is debatable...it depends on their tech level. Those of us reading these forums mostly would rather go buy a new DVD in the store for $20 and then rip it ourselves for our own use. But many others don't want to be bothered, and would be happy to have pre-ripped versions for download and avoid ammassing an even larger collection of DVD boxes taking up space in their bookshelves.
Just like with new Mac computer releases...Apple comes up with options designed for the entire base they plan to sell to, not solely based on "power-user" needs/desires. $20 a pop is NOT "too expensive" for pricing for many...it's not a DISCOUNTED price, but it's a fair price and if the movies need to sell for $20 to get all the studios on board (in the future, if not now), that is more important than trying to be an uber-discount movie sales site.
Those who've mentioned Netflix are missing the point...doesn't matter what Netflix costs vs. iTunes movies because Netflix is a rental-based system and iTunes is purchases you own. If you don't WANT/NEED to own the movies, Netflix is awesome. You can't compare iTunes movies to that market though.
Advil
Apr 15, 04:43 PM
the way it tapers in the back... no way ive would let that happen
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